"One marshal seized an American flag that bore a swastika where the stars should be; another took away a sticker that showed the swastika, the Star of David and an equals sign between them."
What the hell is going on in france!?! This isn't even worth mocking, because its so blatantly stupid that it is truly pathetic. The nazis tried to kill the jews, and America defeated the nazis. You should know, frenchie, the germans were parked on your face at the time. Unreal.
What makes it even more absurd, is that these comparisons are usually made by socialists.
Most French are born-to-be socialists :(
Some are even talking about Paris liberating herself in 1945 - I am not kidding, I heard that ;o( The US would have had no other motivation to land in France than containing communism... Humm...
I don't want to defend the French, you know that, but there is indeed some people that have begun to voice their disgust regarding such reactions. But that's not enough in my opinion :(
Humm.... next the French will be nationalizing socialism.
Isn't there some way of accessing NYT material without the horror of registering?
Other blogs somehow circumvent the NYT registration.
I refuse to register for fear of winding up on the DNC spam list. Terry McAuliffe has put the world on notice his DNC begging bowl will be everywhere between now and 2K4.
(It goes without saying that the NYT is openly biased and hasn't been in the business of reporting the news for years. Instead it prints the personal statements from otherwise unemployable English majors, who've recently traded up from the second-hand smoke of a Workers World Party cadre to Young Democrat chardonnay-and-brie soirées.)
DGB
It's not because the Jews were victims of Nazi , that they are suddenly a more nice race than others.
By their behavior towards Palestinian Population, some extremists jew, and their are numerous in Isreal reached the level of inhumanity that Nazi reached at that time.
As for swatiska in the place of Stars in the star strangle banner, it can be seen in many other place in theworld than in France.
It reflect twhat the world think about the aggressive behavior of United States....
Nice blog....
Very funny and we can find a lot of so intelligent people writing a lot of intelligent posts about a lot of things they don't know...
So Carine, I heard that 40% of the americans believe that Iraq is behind the 9.11 attack...
And what about those who think that the statue of liberty was made by americans ?
No really, it is really funny to find a blog where people have so much time to waste in bashing the french... Nothing more intelligent to do ? You must be sad persons...
Marc, I think that you are wasting your time. Those persons don't like us, so they will find everything possible that will convinced them they worth more than a thousand french... pitiful...
Oh, and to finish we didn't say "L'arc de défaite", mais "L'arc de la défaite"
[Translation below]
Alors Eric, visiblement tu n'as rien de plus intelligent à faire non plus ?
D'autre part, *l'arc de défaite* n'est pas grammaticalement incorrect en français. D'ailleurs, on ne dit pas *l'arc du triomphe*, mais *l'arc de triomphe*. Mais comme la majorité des Français, j'imagine que tu donnes des leçons à ces "pauvres ignorants américains" pendant que toi-même tu fais trois fautes d'orthographe par ligne dans ta propre langue...
Eric, les nationalités prennent une MAJUSCULE en anglais. Après *will*, il faut un infinitif : "will convince" pas de D à convince. On dit *they ARE worth more*, et oui, il faut un verbe. Enfin, je suppose que tu as voulu dire *we don't say* et non *we didn't say*. Et je n'entrerai pas dans le détail de la syntaxe.
Vois-tu Eric, un des gros défauts des Français c'est de projeter leurs propres défauts sur les autres. Quand on corrige quelqu'un sur une faute d'orthographe, de grammaire, on fait attention de ne pas en faire soi-même... mais à l'impossible nul n'est tenu !
Et quand tu dis : "those persons don't like us", as-tu pensé au karma ? Oui je t'entends ricaner, mais ça ne m'étonne pas tu sais...
Quant aux Américains qui croient que la Statue de la Liberté est américaine, je ne peux pas leur en vouloir !! Liberté, Egalité, Fraternité, sont des valeurs depuis longtemps oubliées de la majorité des Français, j'en ai peur. Je le vis au quotidien en France. Je suis Française. Donc je sais de quoi je parle.
[Translation]
So Eric, apparently, you have nothing more intelligent to do either...
BTW, the *arc de défaite* isn't grammatically incorrect in French. You don't say *l'arc du triomphe* but *l’arc de triomphe*. But as a majority of French, I guess you're giving lessons to those "poor ignorant Americans" while yourself you're making three spelling mistakes per line in your own language...
Eric, nationalities in English take a capital letter. After 'will' you have to use the indicative, *will convince* with no D to the verb convince. You have to say *they ARE worth more*, indeed, you need a verb. Finally, I guess you meant *we don't say* and not we *didn't say*... And I won't even comment the syntax.
You see Eric, one of the biggest shortcomings of the French is to project their own shortcomings onto others. When you dare correct someone concerning a grammatical or spelling mistake, at least try not to make mistakes yourself. But one can't do the impossible.
When you say: "those people don't like us", did you ever think to something called karma? Yeah, I can hear you giggle, which curiously doesn't even surprise me...
Concerning Americans who believe the Statue of Liberty was made in the US, I can't blame them. Liberty, Equality, Fraternity are values long forgotten for many here, I'm afraid. I live this situation everyday in France. I am French. So I do know what I'm talking about.
"Liberty, Equality, Fraternity are values long forgotten for many here, I'm afraid. I live this situation everyday in France. I am French. So I do know what I'm talking about."
The French that lived in Suburbs of Paris ,and those who live in a small village far from big cities don't have exaclty the same perception of what France is.
Your perception dosn't match this three words. I'm sad for you.
But my perception doesn't match yours. Fraternity can be found in the great friendly atmosphere of french Villages.
Equality can be found in the possibility for people from modest social origin to enter the highest schools in France, without having to pay thousands of Dollars. It's free.
Liberty can be found in the total freedom for the press. The Peter Arnett case wouldn't occur in France. It's only few examples.
"Fraternity can be found in the great friendly atmosphere of french Villages."
That's just sad, really. How many people have to live in a place before fraternity disappears? 100? 500? Whats the breaking point, where so many frenchmen in one place makes fraternity impossible? Unless you meant the "fraternal" behavior to be found in your famous bathhouses...
"Equality can be found in the possibility for people from modest social origin to enter the highest schools in France, without having to pay thousands of Dollars. It's free."
Thats not equality. Equality is when people don't need to have an education from the highest schools of the country to hold a position of great importance, but rather their ability to perform the task which determines their success. It also means everyone has to pay for the school, instead of just the people who are attending it. That may be equal, but it sure isn't very fair.
"Liberty can be found in the total freedom for the press. The Peter Arnett case wouldn't occur in France."
That's right, Peter Arnett once booed the national anthem, so in France he would've already been locked up. Your press is state run and state sponsored, come on now.
Actually, he's right - Arnett woulnd't have been sacked.
Remember, licking the boots of socialists and dictators is quite in vogue over there.
Carine,
je t'accorderais sans conteste que mon anglais est ce qu'il est et qu'il est plus que perfectible, toutefois tu m'accorderas que j'ai fait l'effort de communiquer dans cette langue qui n'est pas la mienne.... Félicitation pour ton anglais qui semble lui de très bonne facture.
D'autre part ta remarque sur l'Arc de défaite est tout à fait pertinente et je m'excuse de mon erreur. tu as parfaitement raison, j'avoue m'être royalement trompé, il faut dire l'Arc de défaite par opposition à l'Arc de triomphe... Méa Culpa...
Par contre quand je tombe sur un site comme celui-ci qui manifestement ne cherche que la polémique et pas le débat, je perds effectivement mon temps à essayé de faire entendre une voix qui ne sera de toute manière pas entendue car pas écoutée...
Je suis navré d'apprendre que tu es malheureuse en France... J'y suis personnellement très bien, même si je reconnais que tout n'y est pas parfait et qu'il y a encore beaucoup de travail pour y faire disparaitre le racisme, l'anti sémitisme et l'intolérance... Et je pense sincèrement que tu devrais passer plus de temps (mais peut-être le fais-tu) à essayer de faire avancer les choses en débattant plutôt que de déblatérer des énormités sur ce site qui, tu m'excuseras, n'est pas un modèle de finesse et de tolérance...
Je te laisserai le soin de traduire ma prose si cela te fait plaisir et que tu penses qu'elle peut intéresser nos amis anglais ou américains (ce dont je doute d'après ce que j'ai compris de ceux qui vont épancher leur soif d'antiFrance sur ce merveilleux site)...
Sur ce, je vous quitte, j'ai assez perdu de temps ici, je vais aller vois ailleurs si on peut discuter entre personnes adultes... Et oui, il existe plein de sites où on peut discuter en toute intelligence avec des anglais et des américains qui ont autre chose à faire que vomir sur les autres (surtout s'il sont français)...
Indeed Eric, these childish Americans are so narrow-minded that they let me in though I was French... humm much to debate about tolerance isn't it.
I am not going to translate your post because I too have other things to do, especially, as you suggest, try to change French mentalities (anti-semitism, anti-americanism...)... but I think I have long given up this noble cause actually.
You do recognize you were wrong though concerning the "arc de défaite", and I owe it to you to let the contributors of this blog know it. I do realize I was right concerning your French too :)
I'm glad Eric you're feeling well in France. You have to recognize that not everyone (and I'm not talking about me) feels this way. And we do have a right to voice our discontent. After all, we're still in a free country, aren't we?
And we're not VOMITING on the French like you said, we're just very very disappointed by the way the French reacted. Eric, admit it, the French have been vomiting on Americans for years!! I'm standing by the US side, because I owe them my freedom and my speaking French too.
Bonne continuation Eric. Ne le prends pas comme un affront personnel. C'est un site SA-TI-RI-QUE. Tout comme les Guignols par exemple (qui encensent Ben Laden au passage...).
Marc,
Is Vichy an example of a village where fraternity exists? Please let me know ;)
Highest schools in France are called Centrale, ESSEC, HEC,... and they are far from being free of charge. I don't think a modest family in France today could afford a +10.000 Euros a year for the highest French schools. That's also why there are so many people in Universities (which aren't free either btw).
And if you still believe the French media are independent, then I'm sad for YOU.
Note to Mike Krempasky:
http://story.news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story2&cid=496&ncid=716&e=5&u=/ap/20030331/ap_on_en_tv/war_arnett
Apparently there is a limit. Mr. Arnett found it, crossed it, and now he's free to practice his First Amendment Rights in Tikrit.
Regads,
DGB
As far as the Statue of Liberty - she has been totally redone (not to mention when she was shipped the blueprints had her upraised arm sticking out of her head). The only original piece is the frame. Anyway, thanks for the statue - now STHU.
By their behavior towards Palestinian Population
You mean the Jordyptians who constantly bomb civilians and then dance like crazed beasts when the news that women and babies were blown into hot red mist across a building reaches them?
The Jordyptians who print patently racist and anti-Semitic garbage, who gobble said garbage with rabid glee, who take every opportunity to blame their pathetic lack of any other kind of ambition except to kill themselves while murdering civilians on Jews?
The same Jordyptians who thought it was quite classy and cool to name the town square in Jenin after the bomber who murdered 4 US soldiers, who push their children into the streets with pictures of Saddam Hussein on their chests and sticks of dynamite strapped to their asses?
The same Jordyptians who are an Arab and international joke, who haven't contributed anything of value to their own society let alone the world, who only exist to murder Jews and drive them ALL into the sea?
Those Jordyptians?
A last word (in my poor english) especially for you Carine...
I do not take it for me, and I recognize your right to express what you believe in. I will even say that this right become a duty when you do not agree with something. I don't expect everybody to agree with me, but I like to have the opportunity to discuss or debate (good word ??) and you can't discuss on the posts of this blog because what we are reading here is so enormous and sometime false that there is nothing to say.
And be sure that I don't hate the Americans (avec un A majuscule, j'apprends, j'apprends). I am against this war for a lot of reasons, but now that the war is engaged, I wish it to be short with few casualties and naturally with a American victory at the end... But this doesn't change the fact that in my mind this war is a big mistake, and we will all pay for it in the years to come.
Quant à ce site, je ne le trouve pas SA-TI-RI-QUE. Je ne trouve rien de satirique à la phrase "1 in 4 frenchman should be shot"....
Mon. Eric SA,
Over the top headlines like "1 in 4 Frenchmen should be shot", though not pretty are not serious. But they are meant to sting.
They have been provoked largely by postings to this forum such as "have many many many more 9/11s" or boasts of France's imminent nuclear annihilation of America, in ten minutes no less. Hardly enough time to find a clean change of socks.
Plus the French press is not so delicate about American sensibilities as it lectures America while finger-kissing the corrupt Jack Chirac's lionizing the likes of Mr. Mugabe.
If you click around the blog you'll see there is serious debate attempted. But by and large it is ignored.
If you want a serious soapbox here, announce yourself, state your positions clearly, cite your sources, and stay on point.
We welcome all intelligent and thoughtful points of view.
Regards,
DGB
I think that this is the biggest problem of your blog...
You have choose to use a not serious tone, and you clearly want to sting or shock the French who are reading your posts...
It is a choice I must respect, and I have to apologize for my first message, a bit too arrogant...
But, you can't expect a serious debate with this tone. If you really want some intelligent discussion here, you have to change your blog and be careful of your posts. You can't expect the French reading your comments not to react like some of them are doing. I do not give them any excuse. Hoping "more 9.11 attacks" is as stupid and dangerous as hoping "1 in 4 frenchman to be shot".
Mon.Eric SA,
No one who has taken the time to put forth a serious argument here has been blown off.
It's a little much to ask that a public blog be polite without recourse to a censor.
If you wilt easily than blogs aren't for you.
But regardless of any mordant wit or stinging sarcasm, solid reasoning and facts win the day. Here and anywhere.
Not everyone who reads the threads posts to them. There is a much larger audience out there following these debates.
Again, I invite you to post here if you have the staying power for serious argument. But you can't blow in here, throw around a few insults, then complain nobody's been very nice.
Regards,
DGB
Although the title has been changed, I stand behind my original name for this post. Why? Because the french claim to be our allies. We are at war. During wartime, aiding and giving comfort to the enemy, for example, publicly supporting their war effort and wishing them victory, is called treason. The punishment for treason is death. So if 1 in 4 frenchmen, our staunch allies, are publicly and actively seeking Iraqi victory during this war, then 1 in 4 frenchman are treasonous, and deserve the punishment associated with the crime. The punishment, of course, is to be shot. If thats not PC enough for you, well too bad. 25% of your nation hoping for the deaths of my friends and neighbors and their defeat in war isn't quite PC either.
JC,
You've drifted a little below your mark here. The "1-in-4" post is still intacto.
Treasonable actions between countries do not exist. Treason is a class of crimes against one's own country or sovereign.
Although the French act as though they own the world, well, the energy of this forum beats down their presumption on America.
No, we cannot prosecute the French for treason. But there is no question as to the crimes she has committed.
The punishments America in its time will exact from France will be in prestige and trade. The only two things that her perfidious French political masters care about.
Regards,
DGB
Eric,
Please tell me, what do you think of former Education Minister Jack Lang declaring: Bush=Bin Laden, and what do you think of journalists hosting troskist Laguillier and letting her say the US deserved 9/11 and that wasn't even enough?
Concernig what Jack lang had say. I have heard all the interview and what he wanted to express is that by attacking Iraq, Bush is playing the game Bin Laden wants him to play. This war will only serve Bin Laden interests by increasing the ressentment arabs and muslims have against the west. We can expect more attacks like the 9.11 one in the years to come, and the risk to see countries like Pakistan or Egypt fall in a more radical position is growing day after day. Now, I agree with you that saying Bush = Bin Laden was stupid. But the sentence was Bush = Bin Laden, no Americans = Ben Laden. The fact is that a lot of French (and I am one of them) do not trust Bush plan to resolve the Middle East troubles, I think that it is a really dangerous plan but I have no ressentment against the Americans.
Carine, we are in a democratic country and people have the right to express their opinions. What Laguilier had say is awful (I didn't hear her say that , but I trust you), but it is her right to express herself. Thanks to our institutions, we already have the right to say what we believe in, and I am sure that you are using your right every day. And if I am not wrong, it is the same in England and in the U.S., even stronger, because in France it is forbidden to say racist or anti-semitist things but it is not the same in England or America. It is in England that all the most radical Islamists in Europe are expressing their views without risking anything. And the first amendment in the U.S. constitution give the rigth to everybody to say what he wants to say. I think, that we don't need any lesson from this two countries concerning the liberty of speaking.
DGB, in the majority of your comments you are insulting the french and you don't support to be insulted by frenchman. Can you explain this to me ?
You sincerely think that we can beging a intelligent and thoughtful debate with this approach ?
Excuse me, but I think to be someone calm and patient, but your posts didn't gave me the feeling that we can discuss in your blog. I repeat what I said, if you want a clear and intelligent speaking in your blog, you have to change the tone, and first of all to look if what you are posting is true before writing your comments. For exemple, you post from march the 12 concerning the front page of the french newspaper "Le monde" was incredible. Did you really believed that our newspapers had choose not to speak of the 9.11 attack because it was a attack againt the US. This is a typical exemple of what make your blog not a good one for debate. You are taking information from everywhere without looking deeper the truth of this information.
Sorry but this don't give me the envy (good word ?) to debate with you, because I am sure that everything I will write will be misunderstood ans turn against me...
Mon. Eric SA,
I have no idea to what comment of mine of March 12 you are referring. My first post to this blog was March 22.
To paraphrase you, this is a typical example of what makes your accusations no good for debate. You are taking information from everywhere without determining the truth of this information.
The insulting tone is called sarcasm. You'll find it in your newpapers, in courts of law, and seats of government.
But, Mon. Eric SA, of course you are familiar with sarcasm, since your own high-minded posts are replete with this rhetorical specimen:
"...épancher leur soif d'antiFrance sur ce merveilleux site..."
"...j'ai assez perdu de temps ici, je vais aller vois ailleurs si on peut discuter entre personnes adultes..."
If you read my posts in context you will find that I give as I get. When "Hombre" posts "100% american should be shot", I am not inclined to be delicate. When "Dick Van Patten" blows in and dismisses cited instances of French deportation of Jews in WWII with the fabulous non sequitur that the Holocaust was America's fault, well, he earns my contempt.
As I have said before, if you wilt easily then this is not the place for you. If your arguments and sensibilities are so delicate then go elsewhere, but spare us your insouciant tongue-clucking.
This is not a knitting club.
The Pave community has a serious complaint with France. If you feel it's not worth your bother to address it, well, bye-bye.
Regards,
DGB
Dear DGB I apologize,
Yes, you are right, it was not a post from you but from Krempasky.
... But the result is the same because you trust this blog to be the new house of truth...
So, if I understand, I am welcome as long as I am sarcastic against the french....
Oh, but I can... There are lot of things that my contrymen are doing or saying that worth sarcasm. You surely know this joke :
"How becoming rich ?"
"Buy a french for what he is, and sell him for what he believes to be."
I love this one. Very funny.
But your sarcasm club doesn't like people scratching its members where it hurts....
Sorry, you see I try to engage an intelligent debate, I apologized for all my mistake... But it seems that sarcasm become your only answer when you feel in danger.
Bye bye
Oh, Eric SA,
Vous petez plus haut que votre cul.
If you've scratched, it hasn't hurt. If you've scratched, nobody's noticed.
We also missed the intelligent debate you promised, exactly in what post did it occur? Isn't it rather the case, Mon. Erica SA, that you have no arguments with any staying power?
"you trust this blog to be the new house of truth..."
The above is sarcastic, Mon. Eric SA, And you gave us to believe you were such a nice little fellow. But no one here weeps. Is this the best you can do?
Are you only posting here to improve your English. I see where Carine has already improved your French.
Please pack up your smarmy hurt feelings and go play with some nice Americans. You are taking longer to exit than MacBeth's dying aria.
Bye-bye, or do you have some clever Parthian shaft to send our way as you search for the door? What is this, your third walk to the door? Can you not escape this blog? What's the problem?
Fin.
DGB
